Government starts mandating a rushed politically driven vaccine, you’re going to see unrest as you’ve never seen. Look for a mass exodus from Virginia.
RICHMOND, Va. (WRIC) — Virginia Commissioner of Health Dr. Norman Oliver said Friday that he plans to mandate coronavirus vaccinations for Virginians once one is made available to the public.
Virginia state law gives the Commissioner of Health the authority to mandate immediate immunizations during a public health crisis if a vaccine is available. Health officials say an immunization could be available as early as 2021.
Oliver says that, as long as he is still the Commissioner of Health when a vaccine is available, he intends on mandating it.
“It [the coronavirus] is killing people now, we don’t have a treatment for it and if we develop a vaccine that can prevent it from spreading in the community we will save hundreds and hundreds of lives,” Oliver said.
Under current state law, only people with a medical exemption could refuse the mandate.
The Virginia General Assembly is considering a bill during the ongoing special session that would allow people with a religious opposition to opt out of the requirment. The bill needs to clear a house committee before the full chamber could vote on it. There is no scheduled date for when the bill will be debated.
Oliver says he strongly opposes the bill. He doesn’t know what the punishment would be for non-compliance but expects that most people will respond well to the mandate.
Meanwhile, a new poll suggests more than one in three Americans aren’t interested in getting a coronavirus vaccine. Even though health officials say it will be safe, some have said they are intimidated by the speed at which it’s being developed.
Virginia Freedom Keepers Director of Communications Kathleen Medaries, a mother of three from Chesterfield, says this is a matter of medical choice.
“This is not a republican or democrat issue. It’s not a pro-vaccine or anti-vaccine issue, ” Medaries said. “For me it’s an issue of being able to assess each vaccine for myself and my family one at a time.”
Oliver believes that, in the case of COVID-19, public health takes precedent over choice.
“He shouldn’t be the one person to make a decision for all of Virginians,” Medaries responded.
Ray Otton says
“that most people will respond well to the mandate.”
The colonists responded well to the British mandate to turn in their weapons at Lexington and Concord.
Just sayin’.
Dean says
There’s enough evidence to prove Dr Fuici and Bill Gates are behind this for economical gain . Look for the removed interviews from the professionals who are blowing the whistle on these two but their information has or is being removed from public viewing . I will oppose any such mandate and will leave this state before being forced into that.
Sorin Varzaru says
What does religion have to do with public health?
As far as vaccination mandates I was expecting the antivaxxers to lose their shit, but hopefully the rest of the people would comply so we can put covid19 to rest and go in with our lives.
Paul Plante says
You are aware, of course, that vaccines are largely ineffective on older persons, nu esti tu?
Sorin Varzaru says
“As to liberals, nice people, generally, Sorin, with nice houses, and nice cars as a rule.
Just lacking in courage and intellectual capacity and the ability to engage in critical thinking, but other than that, they seem nice.”
I am sure you know I am referring to what is it called in US “social liberals” when I talk about liberals. Right?
I agree liberals are generally nice, and more likely then not, have a comfortable life. Also, all the liberals I know, vote democrat. So, when I talk about Democrats, that’s who I refer to. Democrat party politicians are… well, politicians. Since the Democratic party is now pushing some of the policies I care about, I’m voting Democrat. What are those policies? Universal healthcare access is one. I don’t particularly care about what implentation but the situation in us where people have to chose between feeding the family and medication is absolutely insane. I’d like to see more gun control. And by that I mean more control, not total bans. And so forth. I don’t agree with a lot of policies Democrat politicians implemented, but as of now, I see them as the lesser evil.
Ray Otton says
How can we say goodbye if you won’t leave?
Paul Plante says
Are you also aware of the fact that if COVID keeps mutating as it has been doing, that that can and likely will render a vaccine ineffective?
Sorin Varzaru says
“Are you also aware of the fact that if COVID keeps mutating as it has been doing, that that can and likely will render a vaccine ineffective?”
Unlike most people these days I tend to listen to science on these things. So if and when a vaccine is developed I will ask my scientist/doctor friends to look at the data and listen to their recomandations. My post here made the assumption that a vaccine would be mandated after it was proven to be effective and safe for the people it’s mandate for. I find the concept of religious exceptions idiotic and I hope it’s not enacted.
Sloppy Joe and KamalToe 2020 says
Him’s Woke!
Ray Otton says
Good news, you can already get on with your life. You just have to stop listening to the “experts” who have been all over the map on this thing.
BTW, there is a lot of info on the ‘net about the intersection of religion and public health. However, it requires a curious mind to look outside one’s chosen ideology to do the search………………………..and that’s not going to happen, is it?
Sorin Varzaru says
“intersection of religion and public health”
Ray, I have indeed zero interest in the kind of supernatural being you or anyone else chooses to believe in as long as I am not required to pay for or suffer the consequences. Unfortunately, we live in a very interconnected world where what you do or don’t do affects me directly. You refuse the vaccine because your God tells you you can’t have it but go to the emergency room when it hits the fan then die after racking up millions of dollars in bills? I get to pay for that when the hospital charges the rest of us so they can stay in business. So, yeah, no to that “religious exception”
Ray Otton says
You are trying to paint me as something I am not. Nothing new, of course, your tribe attempt to paint my tribe as a bunch of knuckle dragging religious nut jobs whenever you get the chance.
It doesn’t work except with other far left ideologues as the vast majority of folks in the country know there isn’t anything intrinsically evil or stupid with having faith. Even the one who don’t subscribe to a particular religion. Like me.
My point was that you would do yourself a lot of good getting out of your Liberal bubble and read some interesting article about this subject.
NOT about vaxers vs anti-vaxers but about the morals religion brings to the public health debate.
You won’t of course, but maybe my comments will instill others to do a little of their own research into the matter.
So thanks for assisting me with getting the message out and at the same time showing you for the narrow minded person you are….Not that we needed MORE evidence.
Sorin Varzaru says
“You won’t of course, but maybe my comments will instill others to do a little of their own research into the matter.
So thanks for assisting me with getting the message out and at the same time showing you for the narrow minded person you are….Not that we needed MORE evidence.”
Maybe I am narrow minded. Hell, I’ll go and admit it right now that I am. There are only that many things I can care about, and many years ago I decided that religion was not one of them. I support your right, and anyone elses to excercise your beliefs as long as doing so doesn’t put an unreasonable burden on me. I believe “religious exceptions” from a vaccine mandate are nuts as a concept, and I don’t support them. That was my point.
Paul Plante says
You sophisticated, cosmopolitan and urbane Europeans, I notice, compared to us Americans, have a very highly developed sense of drama, Sorin.
Paul Plante says
It’s interesting, Sorin, to see both you and Trump on the same page here and the same team with respect to COVID cures like drinking bleach and taking hydroxychloroquine.
In fact, you should be positively giddy with glee and ecstatic with joy that Trump had his Food and Drug Administration approve the use of convalescent plasma, the antibody-rich component of blood taken from recovered COVID-19 patients, as a treatment for serious coronavirus cases, notwithstanding the World Health Organization, and everybody knows what Trump said about them, on Monday warned that the plasma therapy hailed by President Donald Trump Sunday still is unproven and cautioned that the there is “very low evidence” that it is safe and effective, while medical experts said the potential plasma treatment may provide benefits to those battling the disease, while questions remain about when it should be administered and dosage.
And if that were not enough to have your little flagpole standing right out straight, AstraZeneca shares rose 1.9% today on news that the drugmaker was in talks with the Trumo administration about emergency use authorization of its coronavirus vaccine, a day after the Financial Times reported that Trump may order the FDA to grant the same type of approval for its vaccine, which is being developed by University of Oxford researchers.
So with you on TEAM TRUMP, Sorin, you seem to have picked the winning team when it comes to putting a real good ass-whupping on COVID.
Sorin Varzaru says
“It’s interesting, Sorin, to see both you and Trump on the same page here and the same team with respect to COVID cures like drinking bleach and taking hydroxychloroquine.”
Your thought process is a mistery to me. I have no comment on this pile of garbage you just posted.
Paul Plante says
Uh, not to put too fine a point on it, Sorin, but you did just comment on it.
Sorin Varzaru says
“Uh, not to put too fine a point on it, Sorin, but you did just comment on it.”
Paul, someone is impersonating you. I know there is no way you’d post a single sentence.
Paul Plante says
Someone has indeed impersonated me, Sorin, but not in this case, which actually, if you look at it logically and rationally, as opposed to getting all emotional about it, only required a single sentence to remind you that in fact, you had already commented on my post above where I had you and Trump on the same team, and that was through both inductive and deductive reasoning using as impeccable logic the fact that you are terrified of COVID, scared ****less, in fact, as do a lot of people in America right now, Sorin, so you certainly are not alone, even though at times, it may feel that way, and you feel, probably correctly, that your life has been turned upside down, and your American Dream upended by COVID and religious people who refuse to get vaccinated for COVID and thus, have put your life in jeopardy, and if you listened at all to Melani9a Trump last night, Sorin, it is clear that of the two presidential candidates, “Corn Pop” Biden on the one hand, who is campaigning on a platform to bring light to America, and Trump, it is Trump who hears your cries from the wilderness, and it is Trump who feels your pain, and so it is Trump who is willing to take any risk and do whatever it takes to keep you personally safe, because Trump likes immigrants, Sorin, so it is only logical that you would be for Trump – afterall, your life depends on it.
Sorin Varzaru says
“Trump likes immigrants, Sorin, so it is only logical that you would be for Trump – afterall, your life depends on it.”
Paul, I would get an MRI if I were you. The only thing that would explain your conclusion is a brain tumor.
Paul Plante says
One thing that I have noticed about urbane, cosmopolitan, Continental Europeans such as yourself, Sorin, is how very well developed your sense of humor is compared to we parochial, provincial Americans who it could be said have a very undeveloped sense of humor compared to yours.
Sorin Varzaru says
Ray, Paul I think I finally ran out of steam with this debate, and maybe all debates here on CCM. At least for now. Still have a month of travel around the US and it’s seems insane to spend my time posting here. Tonight I’m camping in Idaho at a blueberry farm and just had an amazing blueberry pie. I think I’ll take a walk around the farm, it seems such a better use of my time.
Enjoy democrat/liberal bashing free from interference from the likes of me.
Ray Otton says
See, here’s your problem in a nutshell.
A number of us in the CCM comments section took you to task for some pretty boneheaded comments and your response is that we’re bashing you.
For instance:
You wouldn’t admit that the 560 riots in US cities over the past 3 months are a problem.
You won’t admit that a well intentioned young man was clearly defending himself from mob attack.
You mocked people of faith.
And that was just this week.
You don’t realize it but you’ve ran out of steam here at the CCM a long, long time ago.
Have a nice trip riding through those orderly red states and stay the hell away from those fiery but mostly peaceful blue cities. ( Advice offered in the most unbashful way )
Publius Americanus says
No, Sorin. You have two weeks.
Since Va is a Covid red state, Idaho requires you to self quarantine for two weeks. I presume you have done so, or you are simply yet another liberal hypocrite.
Guess what. Sorin? I know the answer……..
Judy Pruitt says
No one cares about your ‘interference’ but you.
Paul Plante says
Blueberries have a lot of healthful qualities, Sorin, so it is good to see you eating them to stay healthy.
I have some each day myself, locally grown with no chemicals added.
So enjoy.
And enjoy your travels!
Paul Plante says
And Sorin, this isn’t the EU – over here, we have FOR-PROFIT healthcare with the emphasis on FOR PROFIT!
To me, that is obscene, but such it is.
Paul Plante says
That the Americans as a people have degenerated from their ancestors in point of stature, limitation of life, and ability to endure fatigue, would seem to be a fact generally admitted.
Some of the causes it may be well to notice, as it is highly important as a nation, we should not only have vigorous understandings, but strength of body to plan and execute any undertaking man may perform.
One of the most obvious causes of declining strength, is the sedentary life of an increasing number of our citizens, added to the fact that far too little exercise is taken in the open air.
It is so ordered on our planet, that man shall acquire a living by the sweat of his brow – and it is further ordained, that the labor implied in the mandate shall invigorate his bodily powers.
Another reason why we do not possess the constitutions of our ancestors, is, our luxurious mode of life when compared with theirs.
– HISTORY of SCHOHARIE COUNTY, and BORDER WARS OF NEW YORK; containing also A Sketch of the Causes which led to the American Revolution; and Interesting Memoranda of the Mohawk Valley; together with Much Other Historical and Miscellaneous Matter, Never Before Published by Jeptha R. Simms, 1845.
Paul Plante says
And how do you manage to equate people giving you facts about BIG PHARM using doctors to push their pills for them to democrat/liberal bashing?
Paul Plante says
MARKETWATCH
“AstraZeneca’s U.S. stock falls on report of coronavirus study halt”
By Wallace Witkowski
Published: Sept. 8, 2020 at 6:32 p.m. ET
U.S.-traded shares of AstraZeneca PLC fell in the extended session Tuesday following a report that the drug maker halted a COVID-19 vaccine study following an adverse reaction from a participant.
The drug maker said the Phase 3 clinical study is on hold while it reviews an suspected adverse reaction in the U.K., according to a report by Stat late Tuesday.
Paul Plante says
Sorin, as you are wondering around out there in search of America, and you have some free mental time, ask yourself this essential questions that those of us who don’t have the luxury of fleeing, as you do, to the EU to get as far away from here as possible ask ourselves as the Democrats steer us towards another civil war of their making, just as the last civil war was of their making: why are Democrats and the faction they belong to, which in the best of times represent only a third of the American people, making Democrat rule a tyranny of the minority, like the Sunnis in Iraq when Saddam was in power, worthy of any respect whatsoever?
You continually whine about us “bashing” (severe criticism) the Democrats, when we see the Democrats bashing (violent physical assault) America, burning, looting, destroying.
Should we be heaping praise them, instead, do you think?
Should we who actually know the history of this country and the role played by the Democrats in making it less than it could have been with their slave holding, their secession, their civil war, where they did get bashed but good, and the Viet Nam war as only a few examples, be embracing the Democrat party instead, telling us how great they are because they have ditzy Nancy Pelosi as their leader?
You don’t see us out there doing any bashing of either America or the Democrats in terms of the use of physical violence, such as when Democrat Preston Brooks nearly caned Republican Charles Sumner to death in the United States Senate.
You don’t see us out there burning down America while the liberals cheer on the destructives.
So what makes the Democrats and liberals worthy of respect in your eyes and what makes us so odious, those of us who use words to express our displeasure, as opposed to sticks, stones, bricks, iron pipes and the arsonist’s flaming brand?
Do you really hate America so much and what it stands for that you would cheer on the Democrats as they destroy it, because in the history of this nation, you don’t find evidence of them doing any real building up of civilized society?
Why do you castigate us for standing for something we have believed in since the days of our youth, as opposed to being a bunch of cowardly kneelers, who because they stand for nothing, are worthless in our eyes?
Sorin Varzaru says
Paul, as usual your comments are filled with false premises, cherry picked examples of actions of Democrats/liberals and an obvious lack of interest in reality. As I said before, I’m too busy traveling to waste my time arguing with you.
Paul Plante says
What a cheap way out you take, Sorin, which is why “liberals” in this country get no respect on one hand, and are held in contempt on the other, because instead of backing up your assertions with facts and demonstrating rationally and logically how and why Democrats and the Democrat party are worthy of respect, notwithstanding their lengthy record which makes them quite contemptible in the eyes of Americans like myself who don’t belong to political factions, all you can offer is some mealy-mouth, whiney emotional BULL**** reminiscient of a five-year old throwing a sulk because he or she can’t get their own way, WAH, WAH, WAH.
I didn’t ask you to argue with me, Sorin, since there is no argument.
What I asked you to do was to refute a contention of mine that the Democrats and their faction of only one-third of the American people, those like you unable to think, only to “feel,” being led by their passions and emotions, are only worthy of our contempt as a people as they lie to us and mislead us and divide us, and head us towards another civil war.
If I was so wrong as you say, my goodness, you could have knocked me out of the batter’s box with one well-aimed brush-back pitch by providing examples to refute my contentions and prove yours.
Instead, you chose to whine and screech.
Such it is when it is, and all you have managed to do is reinforce the impression in the minds of people like myself that it is worthless trying to have any kind of dialogue with those who self-identify as liberal, as they are intellectually too weak to have a part in it.
So enjoy your trip, Sorin, see the country, enjoy the views, and feel thankful that you are now residing in a free country where you are able to come and go as you please, thanks to people like myself who not only care about maintaining such rights for people like yourself, but are willing to actually stand on the line in defense of them, instead of kneeling in the corner like a coward.
And try some vanilla ice cream with the blueberry pie!
Make it a double treat.
Sorin Varzaru says
“providing examples to refute my contentions and prove yours”
Why would I do that? So you can ignore them? Or deny them? No, waste of time.
And i did try the pie with ice cream. It WAS delicious!
Paul Plante says
I hope you had some good Vanilla bean vanilla ice cream with it, and again, I am glad that you are afforded this opportunity to see the American west – some great scenery out there.
As to the Democrats, Sorin, without need of any help or assistance from yourself, I have held them in contempt for at least fifty years now, so you don’t have to trouble yourself and take away from the joys of your vacation trying to defend the undefendable.
There is nothing about the Democrats that you could tell me that would make any difference at all in how I feel about them, but I thought it fair and sporting to give you a shot at it, to see if you could possibly come up with one good thing you could say in their favor, and here we are.
As to liberals, nice people, generally, Sorin, with nice houses, and nice cars as a rule.
Just lacking in courage and intellectual capacity and the ability to engage in critical thinking, but other than that, they seem nice.
Publius Americanus says
Ahhh, yes….please to get on ze train, it vill take you to ze ‘vaccination’ site. But first a nice shower………
Man, you leftist vermin will do anything the Government tells you to, won’t ya?
Ignore the evidence that this type of virus-like the flu and the cold- don’t respond to vaccinations?
Oh silly me, ‘evidence’ is provided by ze Government……and must be swallowed whole…….
We really didn’t need your kind in America, Sorin. We have enough home grown radical communists doing their level best to destroy us. Consider going back to those socialist crap holes you seem to love so much, and leave us alone.
Maggie says
I agree. I would suggest that the doctor and his family be the first to take the vaccine. No one should mandate that I take something that I am not comfortable with. How do we know if it is safe?
Paul Plante says
BIG PHARM will tell you when it is safe, and it will be safe because BIG PHARM says it is safe, and since you are not an expert and you don’t have credentials, and they do, then you have to believe in them, because they would never lie to you to increase their bottom line.
Stuart Bell says
You better check with The so-called Black Community Leaders and see what they think.
Dean says
The dr needs to look up what civil liberty laws are about before stating he can mandate everyone get vaccinated
Deborah Lewis says
STUFF IT OLIVER!
There is no way that I will ever allow this corrupt Virginia government lunacy decide what I do. Trust you? Really?
Concerned Citizen says
If any state or Federal entity decides to make it a mandatory vaccine, then all elected and officials and their politically appointed personnel and all immediate and extended family members should be required to go back to their home city/county and stand in line with their poorest constituents and get the exact same vaccine (brand, dose).
Concerned Citizen says
If any state or Federal entity decides to make it a mandatory vaccine, then all elected and officials at the state and Federal level, all politically appointed personnel, manufacturers of the vaccine, the FDA, CDC, DHS Feds and contractors, BARDA, the President, Congress and all of their immediate and extended family members should be required to go back to their home city/county and stand in line with their poorest constituents and get the exact same vaccine (brand, dose) while all media outlets film them doing it.
Stuart Bell says
I would not take a dose of their medicine at gun point. If they were to strap me down in a hospital, please believe I would be visiting those that did the strapping and injecting before the sun rose again.
Debbie Lewis says
WELL SAID!
Stuart Bell says
The jails of VA are full of people needing injections…but not for the Kung-Flu.
MJM says
Well, I look at a brand new and hurriedly designed covid 19 vaccine the same way I look at a brand new model car. I don’t buy the first new car that comes out, and let them work the bugs out in the first model year. I also fear covid 19 more than I fear a proper vaccine. So I’m kinda looking at it like if I wait for a few months of the reviews and adjustments to be put in place, the odds are all will work out fine.
A couple of factors……This is The Eastern Shore. I have never seen a single “great new thing” be introduced here before L.A, N,Y, Texas, blah blah blah. All the high population, easier to make money with market penetration areas, all get the new stuff right quick. We are an oversight and last in line. If you want to scream for a vaccine when it comes out, you will probably be able to get one right quick. If you want to wait a little while and see how it works out for the anxious ones, let ’em go and just wait a little. As far as “The Mandate” ? Well Gov. Ralph is a putz, and highly qualified to engage in inconsequential activity. So how long do you think it will take for him to rally the Drs. to be chasing us down the road with a needle full of covid 19 anti venom ?
You don’t want a shot ? That’s your choice. I think there’s more history of vaccines working than not working, so I don’t “get” your choice. I won’t let that affect me. I get the shot and probably don’t get covid. You don’t take a shot ? You can’t make me sick but I might make you sick. I’ve been told that before covid so I won’t let it bother me.
As far as Fauci and Gates investing in vaccine ? People inside the industry and with money to invest often invest in their work and their business world. I don’t blame them. Gates ? He often invests in good things. New things that make him more money and improve many things for any people. If he invests in it that’s a good thing. That is his business history. Gates is just all right with me.
Sorin Varzaru says
Ha, never thought I was going to say this, but I agree with almost everything you said.
VA Tax Payer says
The sloppy science and biased results that plague current normal (timeframe eg 15 years on average) medical countermeasure research and development are exacerbated in regard to drug/vaccine development via emergency use authorization. And although this is not necessarily the same type of treatment, the lessons learned from the disastrous TGN1412 clinical trial (and that was not an emergency use authorization situation) should have all on high alert regarding covid vaccines. Add in the likely use of imported inferior vaccine components (the issues with toxic generics, FDA warning letters- see the orange book, drug recalls) and more red flags are raised in regard to vaccine efficacy and safety even before this talk about a potential state mandate. Obamacare is a disaster that resulted in an exponential increase in the number of brick and mortar health offices/clinics/gross expansion in hospital square footage (all of which are useless now that telehell is being forced down our throats for the same cost as in person visits) so is ludicrous that a covid vaccine needs to be jammed down our throats. Just like depression and suicide continue to escalate exponentially due to social media becoming a substitute for real friends, the way the liberal left and swamp dwellers in DC along with the greedy likes of the Gate’s Foundation and Alphabet (Google’s parent company), are scheming to use covid as an excuse to control an individual’s health choices…the end result will be an even bigger health crisis/disaster. Especially if you take into account the fact that this generation of health care workers from technicians to MDs are a product of the “every kid gets an A even if they did not earn it”; coupled with the ongoing practice that college and medical school entrance criteria are now based on special interest quotas (so unqualified people get into med school and are handed MD degrees they were incapable of earning via academic merit), there is no way anyone under the age of 60 should consider getting a covid vaccine for the next 7 years.
Paul Plante says
AMEN!
MJM says
Well gee, thanks Va. Taxpayer for deciding for so many Americans that a vaccine is stupid and dangerous with such a narrow and negative view. Positivity is nonexistent ? Sloppy science and biased results that plague R+D. That’s a rather broad statement attacking an entire industry as horrible and dangerous. Is it apropos ? Citing one example of TGN1412 for problem research is a reason to distrust all future research ? 108 people were in that trial. One died. Yes there were other problems. The experiment ended there. That’s a reason not try a new vaccine ? Is it possible biolabs learned from the TGN 1412 mistake and have improved their scientific method ? Have the 2007 computers that were replaced all advanced tremendously ? We got rid of a firebomb called the Ford Pinto. So we should stop driving cars ? It’s a new dawn. Did you get the memo ? Muskenstein is researching implanting chips in pig and then human brains to not only create super brain function, but to improve neuro transmission in order to help some blindness and other physical electro impulse problems for tremors/spasms such as cerebral palsy. These chips are not limited to just these ideas either.
I laud such gains. And to think my great grandmother told me of sewing the canvas to cover the carts of the wagon trains as a young girl was helping the advancement of our culture. We’ve come a long way. Embrace the future.
Paul Plante says
MJM, with all due respect, but if you actually put your faith and your life in the hands of these for-profit corporate BIG PHARMS who are in to not to protect you, but for the profits, you’re a ******* moron, which surprises me, because otherwise, you seem rational and sensible about things.
Do you honestly think that BIG PHARM tells you the truth about anything?
Why should they?
And don’t you watch the commercials for all the products they already make, all the serious side effects, and still, notwithstanding, they still dump that toxic **** out on the public, because the public is very stupid and will buy it and take it nonetheless.
You take the vaccine and you can have my dose too, because I am not letting any of that **** into my body.
Dean says
With you all the way
Sorin Varzaru says
“And don’t you watch the commercials for all the products they already make, all the serious side effects, and still, notwithstanding, they still dump that toxic **** out on the public”
The reason Paul they list all the side effects is because ANYTHING you consume has side effects and we daily make calls about cost vs. Benefit. Pain killers can hurt your liver but people (or better , doctors) can make a decision based on probabilities wether or not the patient should take the medicine. Feel free not to take any medicine though. The rest of us aknoledge that science is a good thing. Sure, they occasionally screw up, but listening to sçience on average puts one in a better position.
Blue Hoss says
Go on Home, your Mammy’s calling You!
Ray Otton says
Sorin – “Feel free not to take any medicine though.”
MJM – “You don’t want a shot ? That’s your choice.”
Either of you guys read the title of this piece?
Sorin Varzaru says
“Either of you guys read the title of this piece?”
Sure, but I was commenting specifically on Paul’s rant about the big pharma “pushing” dangerous drugs. All drugs are dangerous in one context or another.
As far as the mandatory thing, I’m ambivalent. I understand the reasons for, I understand the reasons against. If it comes to that I will ask one of my doctor/scientists friends to read the documents pertaining to that vaccine and advice. I don’t feel qualified (and very few people are ) to read scientific papers and asses if a vaccine (or any drug) should be taken or not. But chances are I would comply.
Paul Plante says
Which is why I don’t take that ****, and stay healthy as a result.
Didn’t your mother ever tell you to not put something min your mouth if you don’t know what it is?
Mine did and it was good advice, coming as it was from a registered nurse.
And anybody with basic reading skills can go to the New England Journal of Medicine site and stay abreast of vaccine developments.
The articles are written in plain language, afterall, so you don’t need the Pile it Higher and Deeper degree to understand it.
Paul Plante says
Americans are very big on their pills, Sorin, so it sounds like you have become a true American as well.
Reminds me of a cardiologist I knew who used to get apoplectic about these huge fatties and large loads with heart problems who would come to him not for advice on how to get healthy, but for more pills.
Too much trouble to lose a couple of hundred pounds of fat because it is too easy to get the pills, which BIG PHARM loves, and so do many doctors who get a kick-back from prescribing them, as well as a junket somewhere on the drug companies so they can find out what new poison to prescribe is coming down the pike next week.
As to a vaccine, your savior Trump is now saying there will be one out for you before election day.
Be sure and let us know how that works out for you after you dose yourself up on the ****, which might be nothing more than a blend of Chlorox, Lysol, and some good old WD-40, which works wonders on freeing up rusted bolts, mixed in with some hydroxychloroquine.
Dean says
Well
I read the entire pamphlet that comes with any prescription I am given . I have found that even when I tell physician s and it’s documented in my charts about being allergic to certain meds They still prescribe them . I have had my pharmacist log into their national computer base , not to fill any prescriptions that have certain particles and send it back to prescribing dr. So I feel competent enough to understand the medications or vaccines that after consulting with my pharmacist I will or will not take them
My choice
Not anyone else’s
Paul Plante says
As of 2019, the population of the Commonwealth of Virginia was 8.536 million souls.
So if each one of those persons is forced to have to take this vaccine, we are looking at some big bucks in somebody’s pockets regardless of whether the **** works or not, and if it doesn’t, besides Ghost Busters, who are you going to call?
The finances of this health commissioner need to be looked into to see if he perhaps owns stock in any of these companies making these so-called vaccines.
Ray Otton says
“As far as the mandatory thing, I’m ambivalent…………… But chances are I would comply.”
Seems to me, from earlier posts, you are anything but ambivalent and in fact would absolutely comply and cheer on government agents rounding up those of us who won’t comply.
I mean, rounding up people who don’t agree with them is a Leftist tradition, isn’t it?
Paul Plante says
I’m over 70 and in good health, Sorin, because I stay as far away from doctors as I can and I don’t take pills, including aspirin.
Nioaka Marshall says
Paul Plante, I agree with you all the way. They can have my dose also. I don’t get flu shots, pneumonia shots etc… And I will not take a shot for something I’m pretty sure I won’t get. I never even had childhood immunizations and I’m immune to all of them. Only thing I ever caught was chicken pox at age 6.
Paul Plante says
As to the relationship between BIG PHARM and the doctors who act as their pushers, Sorin, check out this Boston Globe article entitled “Drug companies quietly funnel funds to doctors – Pay for continuing education lectures not made public” by Tracy Jan on August 5, 2015, where we have as follows:
WASHINGTON — Fancy steak dinners, junkets at lush resorts, and cushy speaking gigs to promote new drugs have been on the wane since lawmakers forced drug companies to disclose most of the ways they steered lucrative perks and consulting fees to doctors.
But critics say the stream of drug money to top physicians has flourished on a route that remains largely hidden: the continuing education programs that doctors must attend to keep their licenses.
Federal law allows pharmaceutical and medical device companies to funnel millions of dollars a year, without disclosure, to doctors who teach continuing education programs.
The conduits for the money are independent companies that sponsor medical lectures for doctors.
Since 2011, drug industry payments to these outside companies have risen 25 percent, to $311 million in 2014, according to a Boston Globe analysis.
Doctors who deliver the lectures typically receive between $2,000 and $3,000 per appearance.
The biggest lobbying organization for doctors is fighting in Congress to keep those payments out of public view, backing a bill to derail an Obama administration push for more transparency.
The lobbying group, the American Medical Association, says disclosure would unfairly stigmatize doctors who are leaders in their fields and deliver lectures on breakthroughs in medicine.
But some physicians say payments to provide medical education have been transformed into a bigger channel to conceal drug company cash.
“To be blunt, this is just government-sanctioned money laundering,” said Dr. Paul Lichter, a University of Michigan ophthalmologist who heads the medical school’s conflict of interest committee.
“Companies are making it appear charitable, but it’s clearly to influence physicians to prescribe expensive drugs and order expensive tests.”
end quotes
Or the Alternet.org article “You Won’t Believe the Outrageous Ways Big Pharma Has Bribed Doctors to Shill Drugs” written by Martha Rosenberg on July 21, 2016, to wit:
At the 2010 meeting of the American Psychiatric Association in New Orleans, a psychiatrist from the East coast shared her anger with me about the recent clamp down on Pharma financial perks to doctors.
“They used to wine us and dine us.”
“An SSRI maker flew my entire office to a Caribbean island…but now nothing,” she lamented.
She was right.
Before news organizations and the 2010 Physician Financial Transparency Reports (also called the Sunshine Act, part of the Affordable Care Act) reported the outrageous amount of money Pharma was giving doctors to prescribe its new, brand-name drugs, there was almost no limit to what was spent to encourage prescribing.
At another medical conference I attended, soon after, when it was suggested that doctors not accept free meals from Pharma reps because of indebtedness, a doctor asked in all earnestness “but what do we do for lunch?”
He was right.
Doctors seldom have to go hungry at lunchtime when Pharma reps are around.
Not only do reps reliably bring lunch and free drug samples, until fairly recently they wielded thousand-dollar budgets to send doctors on trips to resorts, golf vacations and to sought after sports events.
No wonder the docs saw them.
But by 2010, much of the over-the-top Pharma largesse had ended.
Not just because the press and Sunshine Act exposed the huge payments, naming names—but because practically every major drug company from GlaxoSmithKline (GSK), Eli Lilly, Abbott, AstraZeneca, Pfizer and Johnson & Johnson to Amgen, Allergen, Bristol-Myers Squibb, Cephalon, Novartis and Purdue had settled a wrongdoing suit.
Both doctors and the public largely viewed Pharma’s safety and effectiveness claims as “bought” by such extravagance.
Still, here are some of the ways Pharma managed to get drugs into your medicine cabinet when the financial excess bestowed on doctors was tolerated:
1) Blue Cross Blue Shield said that Pfizer jetted 5,000 doctors to Caribbean resorts where they enjoyed massages, golf and $2,000 honoraria to try to increase prescriptions for its painkiller Bextra—a drug that proved so unsafe it was withdrawn from the market in 2005 for heart risks.
2) The Justice Department charged that GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) “paid millions to doctors to promote Wellbutrin, approved at the time for depression, for off-label uses by funding meetings, sometimes at lavish resorts,” according to CBS News.
Off-label uses ignore FDA approved indications in favor of whatever Pharma wants to say to sell a drug.
3) Johnson & Johnson wined and dined Texas Medicaid officials, charged state authorities, treating them to trips, perks and honoraria to get its expensive antipsychotic drug Risperdal preferred status on the state formulary where it would be paid for by taxpayers. (Taxpayers were also bilked by the Department of Veterans Affairs expenditure of $717 million on Risperdal only to discover the drug worked no better than a placebo.)
4) Bristol-Myers Squibb enticed doctors to prescribe its drugs with access to the Los Angeles Lakers and luxury box suites for their games, according to California regulators.
5) And, in keeping with the marketing free-for-all that has hooked so many Americans on opioid drugs, opioid maker Victory Pharma was charged with treating doctors to mortgage assistance and… lap dances.
end quotes
You put your life in their hands, Sorin – as for me, I’ll keep mine in my own where it has been safe now for many, many years.